Assolutamente d'accordo. Non c'entrano nulla.
L'ho notato appena visti i primi rendering.
chissà che gli è venuto in mente

_________________
Alla guida di una KIA SPORTAGE 1.6 Turbo Benza Ibrida
Guidavo una Stelvio senza Apple CarPlay
Guidavo una sorprendente svedese - V90 D4
Guidavo una bella A6 SW TDI Grigio Floret. Veloce Comoda Bella Anonima
Guidavo una anonima e puzzolente 320d Touring MSport...
Guidavo una splendida Range Rover Evoque... Si, si girano tutti al semaforo...
Guidavo una fantastica A5 Sportback S-Line, 2.0 TDI 170cv...

Un frontale di quel genere sotto forma di rendering era girato abbinato a non ricordo quale Opel.

_________________
http://www.teamtoyota4x4forum.org/

hai ragione, è appena venuto in mente anche a me

Mboh.. frontale insipido, passaruota verniciati del 208, posteriore che mi lascia perplesso.
Dentro poco personale ma carina.
Piuttosto che niente meglio così, ma vista così non mi dice molto...

_________________
Toyota RAV4 2.5 Hybrid Lounge - 2019
Abarth 595C Turismo - 2016
Royal Enfield Interceptor 650 - 2022
Saab 9.3 Cabrio 2.0T SE- 1998

Perché commentate la nuova Y nel thread delle strategie di Stellantis?

Stellantis CEO sees the rise of Chinese automakers fueling M&A
Tavares points to the PSA and Fiat Chrysler tie-up as proof such consolidations are needed.
Bloomberg
TWEET
SHARE
MORE

Carlos Tavares: "If the automotive industry doesn’t move, it will disappear under the offensive of the Chinese."

Stellantis CEO Carlos Tavares views the ascendance of Chinese automakers, the European Union’s efforts to phase out combustion engines, and the United Auto Workers union’s costly new contracts as among the factors fueling greater potential for M&A.

In an interview, Tavares said antitrust authorities will have to take these circumstances into account when deciding whether to green-light another major deal like the 2021 merger of PSA Group and Fiat Chrysler.


Here are highlights from the conversation that have been edited and condensed for clarity and length.

Are you gearing up for M&A?

The other day, we were working on preparing the way we are going to present the results of the first leg of the Dare Forward 2030 plan. When we were preparing this, I asked the team, is there anything that has changed over the last three years compared to the moment where we built the plan? The answer from the team was the magnitude of the Chinese offensive, which I think is true. The magnitude of the Chinese offensive, the competitiveness that they can demonstrate and the massive arrival of all of their best carmakers is a significant change.


What does this mean for you?

It means that when these contenders come to our markets with the ability to sell the EVs at the same price as internal combustion engine vehicles, and at the same time the western governments are imposing 100 percent battery-electric vehicle sales, it is quite obvious that the guys who cannot make cost-competitive BEVs are going to be in an existential problem.


SPONSORED CONTENT FROM S&P GLOBAL MOBILITY
2024 US Presidential Election and the Auto Industry
The 2024 US presidential election could end up a second Biden-Trump contest, with former President Donald Trump the front runner for the Republican party nomination after securing a win in the Iowa caucus this week and President Joe Biden currently the front runner for the Democratic party nomination.
READ MORE
The companies that did not prepare themselves for this impact are going to be, from my perspective, in trouble. Which means that we need to be fit and we need to be ready. If those opportunities were to materialize, then we want to be part of that consolidation. The guys who have not been doing their homework in cost reduction are the guys that are going to put themselves in trouble.


So, you see a wave of consolidation coming in the automotive industry?

Consolidation will come, and it will put the western world in a difficult situation to decide what to do with antitrust. The current antitrust rules are counterproductive to face the Chinese offensive. At one point in time, if you have to fund a very expensive technology and you don’t have scale, you will put yourself in trouble. Fortunately, thanks to the European Union, which I would like to thank here, we could create Stellantis and it is absolutely fair to say that we were supported by the European Union. Had we not done that, we would have been in deep trouble. FCA would be in trouble, and PSA would be in trouble. So that was the right move at the right timing.

Do you see Renault as vulnerable?

The lack of scale is always a problem. It is also a question of strategy. I respect the courage of Renault to do something which is very different. And that’s one of the reasons why I am looking at what they are doing, because it’s refreshing and because I can learn from any of the good things they would be doing. It could be for me an inspiration for things we could do ourselves.
What they are doing in France is good, and I’m trying to face a very harsh competitor. It’s normal that I fight against a competitor. That’s what the European Union wants — harsh competition to the best benefit of the consumer. It’s normal that we are looking at a very efficient competitor in France and that we try to beef up our own activities to be able to face them.
It is quite clear that I think that this transformation will lead to a certain number of problems. More and more, you see Chinese partners or suppliers in the constellation of Renault.
We will see how this is going to unfold, including in the eyes of the French government. I have no specific interest in this company more than any other; I’m just observing that they have a different strategy. But I have all always showed respect, vis-à-vis the company.
I was surprised by their Old Co.-New Co. strategy. And as you know, my thinking is exactly the opposite. We need one single team putting the company in one single direction with the full scale and the full power. Because what is going to fund the electrification is the profitability of ICEs. So, if you cut what is profitable, and you isolate what is not profitable, how can you fund what is not profitable in the world where the interest rates are high?

What about General Motors and Ford?

I don’t know; it depends on what the situation will be. There is one thing that I believe is a precondition for everything, is that it represents a win-win. And it’s done in a friendly manner, which means a convergent manner. If the automotive industry doesn’t move, it will disappear under the offensive of the Chinese industry. I’m just trying to figure out first how I make my company successful. And secondly, if that is the case, what are the opportunities that will appear? If I don’t have financial soundness, then it’s not possible. The second one is, to make sure that whatever we do, if we were to do something, we do it in an amicable way. For me, that’s fundamental. We are not going to make hostile things.
Why? Because it is already difficult. When you make friendly things, as we did with Stellantis, it’s already difficult to face the criticism of all the naysayers.
So, if two companies were to come together, they need to be sincerely convinced that the synergies that would come out of that process would create value for all the stakeholders.

What does Jeep need to do to turn its fortunes around?

We have two excellent top executives that are leading the two engines of the North American business. Most of it is about Ram and Jeep, with Tim Kuniskis and Antonio Filosa. We have now a new regional COO with a very demanding executive that did an excellent job in Mexico. So, with Carlos Zarlenga, Antonio Filosa and Tim Kuniskis, we have three excellent executives who are going to work together to pull North America back to a better position.
We need to deal with the consequences of the UAW strike. That has a huge impact on the profitability of the U.S.
We need to continue to work the quality and the cost, but I think they just need a more dynamic management to be in a much better position.
For the product plan and pipeline, they have everything they need. The Jeep Recon, the Jeep Wagoneer — all of these are fantastic products that will certainly give a boost of confidence to the Jeep teams.

Intervista integrale di Tavares a Bloomberg. Il ceo portoghese dichiara di essere pronto per il consolidamento del settore di fronte alla pressione competitiva dei gruppi cinesi. Tavares sostiene che il nuovo management di Jeep potrà raddrizzare la situazione.

https://m.dagospia.com/john-elkann-smen ... ult-383715

Elkann ha negato trattative in corso con Renault.

Quindi vuol dire che ci sono..?

_________________
Vw T-Roc 1.0
Guidavo Alfa 147 JTDm e Mazda MX-5 NC 1.8

Sembrerebbe che il governo francese stia spingendo in quella direzione, che poi succeda è una questione ben diversa.

Esatto.

Come voler rovinare un prodotto datato ma ancora valido.
Facelift di Renegade, hanno piazzato un tablet di Aliexpress sulla plancia.
Mi ricorda l'ultimo Uconnect piazzato sulla Giulietta, una roba aftermarket.

_________________
Seat Leon 1.4 E-Hybrid Phev 204 cv

Commercialmente la Renegade sta soffrendo molto la Avenger, basta guardare la top 50 italiana a gennaio.

MA non mi sembra, tutto sommato è un bello schermone integrato nella console.

Quello a cui fai riferimento direi che è tipico di Q5, per fare un esempio....

_________________
Sai che cosa diceva quel tale? In Italia sotto i Borgia, per trent'anni, hanno avuto assassinii, guerre, terrore e massacri, ma hanno prodotto Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci e il Rinascimento. In Svizzera hanno avuto amore fraterno, cinquecento anni di pace e democrazia, e che cos' hanno prodotto? Gli orologi a cucù.( O.Welles)

Io avevo trovato questo, e non mi pare un granché come integrazione.

_________________
Seat Leon 1.4 E-Hybrid Phev 204 cv

Ovviamente con questo my togliendo la diesel e la 1000 t3 le cose non cambieranno molto anzi...
Rimane un ottima auto, superiore ad avanger, da prendere usata o kmo.

_________________
ALFA ROMEO GIULIETTA jtdm-2 20 170cv- distinctive-pack premium-pack sport 18 - Luglio 2010 -superati i 313.333KM!!!

MILAN -- A recent war of words between Italian Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni and Stellantis CEO Carlos Tavares has exposed a tough new reality: Europe's one-time homegrown national automakers have become global players ready to exploit the EU's overcapacity of car factories to obtain better government deals.

Stellantis, created by the combination of France's PSA Group and Italy's Fiat Chrysler Automobiles, accounts for virtually all of Italy's car production.

Fiat output has been falling as European sales have stagnated and Stellantis has shifted production to other countries in its sprawling global network.

Stellantis' capacity utilization rate at its European factories stood at 56 percent last year, down from 64 percent in 2019 and well below the 71 percent rate at Volkswagen Group, according to GlobalData data provided to Reuters.

Automakers aim for at least 80 percent capacity utilization.

RELATED ARTICLE

Fiat 500e output in Italy falls short as buyers wait for incentives, union says
Renault gets France's backing to stay stand-alone amid merger talk
Stellantis is using its excess production capacity for leverage in bargaining for subsidies and policy support from Rome and governments in other countries.

In the United States, state and federal officials offered subsidies to persuade Tavares not to close a Jeep plant in Illinois, which will now be used to build a new midsize pickup truck that fills a gap in the company's U.S. model lineup.

The world's third-largest automaker has so far allocated more European electric-vehicle production to France, Justin Cox, director of global production at GlobalData, told Reuters.

The company's North American truck and Jeep SUV operations generate the majority of the group's profit. Stellantis will report 2023 financial results on Thursday.

"You can see why the Italians are upset ... Italy has got a hell of a lot to lose," Cox said. "All of their volume production is tied up with Stellantis."

On paper, France and Italy appear evenly matched within Stellantis' production system. Stellantis built 735,000 vehicles in France in 2023 and 750,000 in Italy.

But Stellantis is Italy's sole major automaker, while France can also lean on Renault and is bolstered by more planned future EV models.

Italy's total automotive production stood at around 800,000 vehicles last year, versus 1.5 million units in France, according to AlixPartners.

Italian officials have demanded that Tavares rebuild Fiat production to 1 million vehicles a year. Meloni has criticized Stellantis' decisions in nationalistic terms.

Meloni said in Parliament that the "alleged" merger that created Stellantis "actually disguised a French takeover." She added: "It's no coincidence that the group's industrial choices take France's interests in bigger consideration than Italian ones."

Tavares - who has made Stellantis one of the industry's most profitable companies - has countered that the automaker is "not afraid of the 1 million mark ... But let's not forget that it always (depends on) the size of the market."

Tavares and Stellantis Chair John Elkann, scion of Italy's Agnelli family, have engaged in talks with the Meloni government.

The company has said Rome must do its part to support increased output - give incentives for consumers to buy EVs, lower energy costs and encourage the development of the EV charging network.

Earlier this month, Italy launched a new auto purchase incentive, worth 950 million euro ($1 billion) for this year.

Stellantis has been shifting production of cheaper vehicles to low-cost countries, assigning more expensive models to France or Italy.

Rome's discontent reflects a growing awareness it has few tools to leverage Stellantis' decisions, said Marco Santino, a partner at management consultants Oliver Wyman.

"Stellantis has no plans to divest from Italy, or from France," he said. "But it's a global group, which does not make industrial choices based on national preferences."

Stellantis and its European rivals now face weakening car demand and intensifying competition, which usually means lower prices and tough choices. Chinese automakers are ramping up shipments of EVs that they are offering at prices European manufacturers cannot match if they want to turn a profit.

Italy, EU's third-biggest economy, is home to Europe's second-largest auto parts industry, according to local auto lobby ANFIA.

But 40 percent of suppliers specialize in combustion-engine technology and more than 70 percent are still exposed to it.

Santino said "brain" functions in Stellantis, such as engineering, R&D and platform design, have progressively shifted away from Italy since Stellantis was formed, as PSA was further ahead in developing EVs than Fiat-Chrysler.

"The French auto part industry ... is now more innovative and stronger," Santino said. "This is the real imbalance."

France is one of Stellantis' main investors with a 6.1 percent stake through state-backed investment bank Bpifrance and has a representative on its board.

Italy has no presence in the group, but Industry Minister Adolfo Urso has said Rome is open to buying a stake.

"Product allocation does not depend on governance," said Francesco Zirpoli, a management professor at Venice University, who notes Stellantis, and PSA before it, have always made a lot of cars in Spain.

Sales also matter.

Full-electric cars made up only 4 percent of Italy's new car sales in 2023, but almost 17 percent in France.

"Italy is not perceived as one of those countries believing in the transition" to EVs, Zirpoli said.

Rather than complaints, "a smarter idea would be to shift talks over a practical level, like convincing Tavares to move back some EV-related R&D and product development functions to Turin, where skills are still high," he said.


Articolo di Reuters sullo stato delle trattative tra Stellantis ed il governo italiano.
Il gruppo franco-italo-statunitense ha enorme sovraccapacità produttiva in Europa, utilizza i propri impianti solo al 56%. L’Italia de facto ha solo Stellantis ed una diminuzione della produzione locale colpirebbe non poco gli interessi Italia anche se vorrei dire che Tavares si è scontrato non poche volte con i politici parigini. In Italia la quota di elettriche è piuttosto bassa e una parte importante dei fornitori non offre ancora prodotti per le BEV, la maggioranza dell’R&D viene effettuato in Francia (lo si sapeva dal momento della fusione con FCA d’altronde).
Intanto la Spagna (che ricordiamoci ha ricevuto parecchi miliardi in meno dell’Italia) è riuscita ad ottenere mega investimenti da parte di molte case per la produzione di batterie.

Però parliamo di un modello con 10 anni sul groppone. Condivido l’idea che per la Renegade fu speso di più, d’altronde i soldi li mise allora in gran parte il gruppo Chrysler.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a4666 ... an-ev-suv/

Il marchio Chrysler è da anni relegato al solo Nord America e dal 2024 ha un solo modello in listino, la Pacifica.
A partire dal 2025 riceverà un nuovo modello, un crossover su base Jeep Wagoneer S (quella elettrica, non quella lunga quasi 6 metri).

Leggo che Tavares ha dichiarato di voler dare a Pomigliano un nuovo modello dopo (e oltre) la Panda, e che si preannuncia una sostituzione nel CdA di Stellantis in favore di un soggetto di nazionalità italiana.
Leggendo tra le righe sembrerebbe che il governo italiano, nel braccio di ferro in corso, abbia compiuto un piccolo passo avanti.

_________________
Toyota RAV4 2.5 Hybrid Lounge - 2019
Abarth 595C Turismo - 2016
Royal Enfield Interceptor 650 - 2022
Saab 9.3 Cabrio 2.0T SE- 1998

Mai abbastanza....ma almeno dopo gli sberleffi di LActalis/PArmalat, Fincantieri e buona parte del mondo bancario e Grande distribuzione... qualcosina anche se pressochè di facciata...sempre meglio di nulla.

_________________
Sai che cosa diceva quel tale? In Italia sotto i Borgia, per trent'anni, hanno avuto assassinii, guerre, terrore e massacri, ma hanno prodotto Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci e il Rinascimento. In Svizzera hanno avuto amore fraterno, cinquecento anni di pace e democrazia, e che cos' hanno prodotto? Gli orologi a cucù.( O.Welles)

Forse hai ragione tu, anche sul sito ufficiale c'è quest'immagine....

_________________
Sai che cosa diceva quel tale? In Italia sotto i Borgia, per trent'anni, hanno avuto assassinii, guerre, terrore e massacri, ma hanno prodotto Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci e il Rinascimento. In Svizzera hanno avuto amore fraterno, cinquecento anni di pace e democrazia, e che cos' hanno prodotto? Gli orologi a cucù.( O.Welles)

Vero, ma rispetto al solito piegarsi e mettersi a 90 mi pare già un discreto risultato (se fosse come stiamo ipotizzando)..

_________________
Toyota RAV4 2.5 Hybrid Lounge - 2019
Abarth 595C Turismo - 2016
Royal Enfield Interceptor 650 - 2022
Saab 9.3 Cabrio 2.0T SE- 1998

Esatto,

_________________
Sai che cosa diceva quel tale? In Italia sotto i Borgia, per trent'anni, hanno avuto assassinii, guerre, terrore e massacri, ma hanno prodotto Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci e il Rinascimento. In Svizzera hanno avuto amore fraterno, cinquecento anni di pace e democrazia, e che cos' hanno prodotto? Gli orologi a cucù.( O.Welles)

https://www.quattroruote.it/news/indust ... 2023_.html

Risultati più che positivi per Stellantis. I margini sono scesi di circa un punto ma rimangono ampiamente sopra la doppia cifra, Vw non arriva al 7,5%.
Il gruppo raggiunge una marginalità molto elevata in Sud America, Nord Africa, Nord America e in Europa. Tavares vuole ridurre e di molto i costi di produzione delle BEV in modo da poter rispondere ai costruttori cinesi. Almeno qualcuno l’ha capito. Nel 2024 saranno lanciate diverse nuove BEV per il mercato Nafta dove Ford e Gm stanno registrando perdite pesanti. Sarà interessante vedere come andrà. Tavares si è mostrato ottimista e persino conciliante con il governo italiano.

Corre voce che Ferrari vorrebbe Maserati (questione di emissioni di gruppo)

Avrebbe senso, Ferrari scarica sulla sottomarca la faccenda delle emissioni e Maserati si salva dalla chiusura

Interessante.....forse per riuscire così a produrre ancora in pò di ferrari non bev....e a Maserati staccarsi un po' da stla ma anche fosse stato prima da fca non farebbe male..
Cmq Pomigliano una Delta al posto di panda vorrebbe dire ridurre di un terzo/ un quarto della produzione non avvicinarsi all'impossibile un milione di auto in Italia.

_________________
ALFA ROMEO GIULIETTA jtdm-2 20 170cv- distinctive-pack premium-pack sport 18 - Luglio 2010 -superati i 313.333KM!!!

Sono perfettamente d'accordo ma se le regole europee non ti permettono di produrre più la Panda che fai?
Maserati è nel caos, hanno bloccato lo sviluppo della Levante e della Quattroporte, la Grecale non sta andando bene. Già a fine anni 90-inizio 2000 Ferrari aveva gestito Maserati e non è andata benissimo.

Ferrari intende ripudiare le elettriche (ovvio, se togli i motori a pistoni va in concorrenza con una Byd qualsiasi, come si ritroverà a fare Porsche se non buttano nel cesso Taiwan e altre amenità simili)

In Maserati stanno “riorganizzando” diversi ruoli spedendone alcuni in Stellantis e tenendosene altri (i migliori)